There is only one man still behind Avram HF, and that is you. Damn, even the bloody Davids have started to realise but you haven't.
I'm still perplexed as to why you supported him. I have a theory though; you came to a crossroad a few months ago where the decision had to be made whether to go with Grant or against him. You saw that most of us were against him at the time so this was the perfect chance for you to go the other way, hope he does well, and then laugh at all of us because HF was right and everyone else was wrong. After-all, that is what all this is about.
You gambled HF, even though you probably didnt even believe what you was backing, but just for the sake of saying you were right and we were wrong, you went with it. You saw it as a win win. As time went on, you had gone beyond the point of no return and continued to back him. What made it worse for you was the odd decent result we got....it kept you interested, kept you thinking you was doing the right thing. But this Grant fascination had you blinded, because despite the odd decent result, we hardly ever played well, and that is something you should have noticed. Had you noticed that, you would have saved yourself and noticed what Grant was. But blinded, you kept backing him and backing him, and now here we are.
Burnley, Hull and Portsmouth kept us up. We did not reach the required 38 points for Zola to be credited with keeping us up. Will Grant keep us up? I would back him to better Zola's points total! Will that be enough? Maybe not. It is a stronger Prem this year!
Well Portsmouth were Grant's team, so don't embarrass yourself by using them to support your argument because you'll merely be supporting mine!
And as for your 'the league was weaker last season' argument; I have shown before that's garbage. Plus, there are far more teams doing bad and within reach this season, not just 2 or 3, but we are still bottom! More teams are trying to keep us up, but we're still bottom!
Thanks to the mess Zola left behind. Name me a team in the present Prem that Zola's team finished above last season - except for the promoted clubs who are stronger than those that went down.
The window was closed when Grant took over Pompey and there was a transfer embargo in place in the January window. It WASN'T Grant's team!
Of course there are comparable games - 17 of the 20 teams were in the division last season.
Should we keep him? I posted that my confidence was eroded by that performance at Newcastle. Should we have sacked Pardew after that 4-0 hammering at Bolton? No. Should we now sack Grant because a Pardew team hammered his side 5-0? Did we sack Curbishley after Reading thumped us 6-0? Should we have sacked him? Would we have stayed up had we done so?
Has Grant lost 5 on the trot like Zola? Has he lost three consecutive games 4-0 like Curbishley? Has Grant been given enough time to stamp himself on the team?
Lots of questions. Zola ran out of questions. He had been given 18 months and he "achieved" our lowest ever points total in the Prem.
Stani, don't waste your energy to try to persuade HF that Grant is not really good for West Ham! The subject is even beyond debate. It is pathetic that we sit here try to convince HF of the bloody obvious. It is not worth the effort. HF, please declare that you are a Spurs fan so that we can all stop wasting our time with your stupid issues. Grant is s**t and we all know it. If he is not sacked now he will take us down. End of story! No more comments from me on this issue from now on.
Beneath you if this is really you Sav. The Spurs jibe is pathetic. I may be sad but would any Spurs supporter really devote the amount of time I devote to this blog to West Ham? Why would he bother? We are not even a skin blemish on the arse of Tottenham at the moment!
Someone on soccernet posted this comment and I think it is quite apt:
"This is beyond ridiculous already. Grant is a solid manager, but he was set up to fail from the beginning at West Ham by pre-determined negative media and fan reaction. The media has had it out for this guy since his appointment at Chelsea, where he should have won the Champions League for the first and only time in Chelsea's history I may add. His last two stops have been just awful clubs in terms of talent, and he has done more with less in my opinion. Portsmouth was on the verge of going out of business and spent no money, and West Ham has talked a big game with Gold and Sullivan, but in reality they have done practically nothing to improve the club, and they have been hit by a rash of injuries to boot.
How can Grant or any manager succeed when immediately after their appointment fans and media want them gone after losing a single game? The Grant out stories started from day one, and this is what, the fifth time Grant has been given an ultimatum this season to save his job? Who can work under those conditions? If the owners didn't have the confidence in their convictions why hire him in the first place? You can't jump ship if things aren't going well straight away. Some people act like WHU is a good club and Grant's just screwing things up. They should have went down last season on just 35 points."
The guy is right, WHU are anything but a "good club" right now, not have they been a good club for many a year.
HF, But you said the league is stronger so how are there comparable games? And if the league is stronger, why are we not stronger? Did Grant not have time? Money? Support of the Chairmen?
So are you saying we should keep him? Why couldn't you give a simple answer to a simple question HF? Having enough time is relative. It depends on the support and money given and number of players brought in. It is also relative to any improvement seen or not. Hence, he has had enough time to make at least some improvement but there has been no improvement.
We finished 9th under Zola in 08/09. This is proof when things are ok behind the scenes, he can excel.
Sav, I feel your frustration...and I've got the flu too so maybe I'll stop now. Just still wondering, like you, why HF is supporting him. There simply is no footballing reason. He accused me of being antisemitic because I criticised Grant on FOOTBALLING REASONS but I won't accuse him of supporting Grant because he is an Israeli sympathiser. I'd still love to know why he supports him though.
I see that you are not the only only thinking that our proper position in the table is bottom and that we don't deserve any better. Ergo the argument that "it's not poor Grant's fault and it's shit club that West Ham is that is the problem", which you have been putting forward for so long now HF. You are surprised and offended when I jokingly call you a Spurs fan. What do you expect me to say? How are your comments and line of thinking different from 10:39's comments who is obviously a fan of Spurs or perhaps Sheffield United that absolutely hates West Ham and thinks we don't deserve any better?
HF just because Avram hasn't hand picked the whole team he is still responsible for Wins and Losses. If your telling me a manager can only be responsible for wins and losses when he "picks" his team then you are wrong.
I see what your talking about, but Avram has been given way too many chances, he should have been sacked awhile ago. The fact that he got cup ties to prove himself is ridiculous, especially given who we play. The David's are pursuing a drop. You can hate Zola all you want but he kept us up.
Hey what happened to a "busy" January we were promised??? Did the David's mean busy by us having to worry if Grant will be gone or not?
Typical twisted logic by you HF. If Grant doesn't save us, like Zola did, he will fail. It is a different League this year. The only comparison with last and any other year is whether we stay up or not. As far as I am concerned, even if Avram Grant gets us 42 points and takes us down, it will be a worse record than Zola's.
"The only manager I've ever played for who turned the dressing room around was Avram Grant. When he first came to Portsmouth we kept losing. The club seemed to be going down the pan, we hadn't been paid, and morale was low. But a good run in the FA Cup kept us buoyant. It was something to focus on, a light at the end of a tunnel – although, sadly, it turned out to be a train. But that FA Cup final glossed over all of our other problems and we were happy under him. He kept us together and guided us towards this light. At the time it was awesome and we believed in him."
There is only one man still behind Avram HF, and that is you. Damn, even the bloody Davids have started to realise but you haven't.
ReplyDeleteI'm still perplexed as to why you supported him. I have a theory though; you came to a crossroad a few months ago where the decision had to be made whether to go with Grant or against him. You saw that most of us were against him at the time so this was the perfect chance for you to go the other way, hope he does well, and then laugh at all of us because HF was right and everyone else was wrong. After-all, that is what all this is about.
You gambled HF, even though you probably didnt even believe what you was backing, but just for the sake of saying you were right and we were wrong, you went with it. You saw it as a win win. As time went on, you had gone beyond the point of no return and continued to back him. What made it worse for you was the odd decent result we got....it kept you interested, kept you thinking you was doing the right thing. But this Grant fascination had you blinded, because despite the odd decent result, we hardly ever played well, and that is something you should have noticed. Had you noticed that, you would have saved yourself and noticed what Grant was. But blinded, you kept backing him and backing him, and now here we are.
-THE END-
He's still there Stani! Unlike Zola!
ReplyDeleteZola kept us up. Do you think Grant will?
ReplyDeleteBurnley, Hull and Portsmouth kept us up. We did not reach the required 38 points for Zola to be credited with keeping us up. Will Grant keep us up? I would back him to better Zola's points total! Will that be enough? Maybe not. It is a stronger Prem this year!
ReplyDeleteWell Portsmouth were Grant's team, so don't embarrass yourself by using them to support your argument because you'll merely be supporting mine!
ReplyDeleteAnd as for your 'the league was weaker last season' argument; I have shown before that's garbage. Plus, there are far more teams doing bad and within reach this season, not just 2 or 3, but we are still bottom! More teams are trying to keep us up, but we're still bottom!
I agree with Cottee
ReplyDeletehttp://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/w/west_ham_utd/9348145.stm
Thanks to the mess Zola left behind. Name me a team in the present Prem that Zola's team finished above last season - except for the promoted clubs who are stronger than those that went down.
ReplyDeleteThe window was closed when Grant took over Pompey and there was a transfer embargo in place in the January window. It WASN'T Grant's team!
Even if Zola did leave a mess, Grant had the opportunity and support to take stock and then improve it. Why has he made it worse HF?
ReplyDeleteDont know if anyone has heard but Tal Ben Haim for just been sent back to Portsmouth, dont know how I feel about this to be ture.
ReplyDeleteNever set the world on fire but gave us a bit of cover.
He hasn't made it worse. He is ahead in the GRANTAZOLA Index based on comparable games. And we are in the semifinal of the League Cup.
ReplyDeleteSo you are saying we should keep him?
ReplyDeleteComparable games? I thought thre were none. You said the league is different so the Grantazola index doesnt apply.
If we're out of the cup by Tuesday (forget the 2nd leg!) then what? If we lose to to Barnsley then what?
Of course there are comparable games - 17 of the 20 teams were in the division last season.
ReplyDeleteShould we keep him? I posted that my confidence was eroded by that performance at Newcastle. Should we have sacked Pardew after that 4-0 hammering at Bolton? No. Should we now sack Grant because a Pardew team hammered his side 5-0? Did we sack Curbishley after Reading thumped us 6-0? Should we have sacked him? Would we have stayed up had we done so?
Has Grant lost 5 on the trot like Zola? Has he lost three consecutive games 4-0 like Curbishley? Has Grant been given enough time to stamp himself on the team?
Lots of questions. Zola ran out of questions. He had been given 18 months and he "achieved" our lowest ever points total in the Prem.
Stani, don't waste your energy to try to persuade HF that Grant is not really good for West Ham! The subject is even beyond debate. It is pathetic that we sit here try to convince HF of the bloody obvious. It is not worth the effort. HF, please declare that you are a Spurs fan so that we can all stop wasting our time with your stupid issues. Grant is s**t and we all know it. If he is not sacked now he will take us down. End of story! No more comments from me on this issue from now on.
ReplyDeleteBeneath you if this is really you Sav. The Spurs jibe is pathetic. I may be sad but would any Spurs supporter really devote the amount of time I devote to this blog to West Ham? Why would he bother? We are not even a skin blemish on the arse of Tottenham at the moment!
ReplyDeleteSomeone on soccernet posted this comment and I think it is quite apt:
ReplyDelete"This is beyond ridiculous already. Grant is a solid manager, but he was set up to fail from the beginning at West Ham by pre-determined negative media and fan reaction. The media has had it out for this guy since his appointment at Chelsea, where he should have won the Champions League for the first and only time in Chelsea's history I may add. His last two stops have been just awful clubs in terms of talent, and he has done more with less in my opinion. Portsmouth was on the verge of going out of business and spent no money, and West Ham has talked a big game with Gold and Sullivan, but in reality they have done practically nothing to improve the club, and they have been hit by a rash of injuries to boot.
How can Grant or any manager succeed when immediately after their appointment fans and media want them gone after losing a single game? The Grant out stories started from day one, and this is what, the fifth time Grant has been given an ultimatum this season to save his job? Who can work under those conditions? If the owners didn't have the confidence in their convictions why hire him in the first place? You can't jump ship if things aren't going well straight away. Some people act like WHU is a good club and Grant's just screwing things up. They should have went down last season on just 35 points."
The guy is right, WHU are anything but a "good club" right now, not have they been a good club for many a year.
HF,
ReplyDeleteBut you said the league is stronger so how are there comparable games? And if the league is stronger, why are we not stronger? Did Grant not have time? Money? Support of the Chairmen?
So are you saying we should keep him? Why couldn't you give a simple answer to a simple question HF? Having enough time is relative. It depends on the support and money given and number of players brought in. It is also relative to any improvement seen or not. Hence, he has had enough time to make at least some improvement but there has been no improvement.
We finished 9th under Zola in 08/09. This is proof when things are ok behind the scenes, he can excel.
Sav,
ReplyDeleteI feel your frustration...and I've got the flu too so maybe I'll stop now. Just still wondering, like you, why HF is supporting him. There simply is no footballing reason. He accused me of being antisemitic because I criticised Grant on FOOTBALLING REASONS but I won't accuse him of supporting Grant because he is an Israeli sympathiser. I'd still love to know why he supports him though.
I see that you are not the only only thinking that our proper position in the table is bottom and that we don't deserve any better. Ergo the argument that "it's not poor Grant's fault and it's shit club that West Ham is that is the problem", which you have been putting forward for so long now HF. You are surprised and offended when I jokingly call you a Spurs fan. What do you expect me to say? How are your comments and line of thinking different from 10:39's comments who is obviously a fan of Spurs or perhaps Sheffield United that absolutely hates West Ham and thinks we don't deserve any better?
ReplyDeleteHF just because Avram hasn't hand picked the whole team he is still responsible for Wins and Losses. If your telling me a manager can only be responsible for wins and losses when he "picks" his team then you are wrong.
ReplyDeleteI see what your talking about, but Avram has been given way too many chances, he should have been sacked awhile ago. The fact that he got cup ties to prove himself is ridiculous, especially given who we play. The David's are pursuing a drop. You can hate Zola all you want but he kept us up.
Hey what happened to a "busy" January we were promised??? Did the David's mean busy by us having to worry if Grant will be gone or not?
If Grant doesn't make it to 38 points, he will fail, like Zola failed. Is that consistent?
ReplyDeleteTypical twisted logic by you HF. If Grant doesn't save us, like Zola did, he will fail. It is a different League this year. The only comparison with last and any other year is whether we stay up or not. As far as I am concerned, even if Avram Grant gets us 42 points and takes us down, it will be a worse record than Zola's.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2011/jan/08/football-managers-sacked-david-james. Yep Grant can't "motivate", but what would David James know?
ReplyDeleteThat link doesnt work.
ReplyDeleteThe main important quote from that article:
ReplyDelete"The only manager I've ever played for who turned the dressing room around was Avram Grant. When he first came to Portsmouth we kept losing. The club seemed to be going down the pan, we hadn't been paid, and morale was low. But a good run in the FA Cup kept us buoyant. It was something to focus on, a light at the end of a tunnel – although, sadly, it turned out to be a train. But that FA Cup final glossed over all of our other problems and we were happy under him. He kept us together and guided us towards this light. At the time it was awesome and we believed in him."