Thursday, 23 April 2009

Why Curbishley was NOT the disaster some would have us believe! Hotshot opines!


When Curb’s was on TV on route for an interview to become West Ham’s football manager, I was praying, please don’t let him become manager, especially as West Ham now seem to have the backing of a Billionaire. I thought it would show a real lack of ambition, and that we should be looking to appoint a top international manager.

My worst fears were realised when he became manager, and I was one of the cynics right from the off, saying we had chosen an average football manager that didn’t fit the new aspirations and financial clout of the club.

I remember people in forums showing blind loyalty to him, and vitriol was directed towards me for stating the blindingly obvious. They persisted to support him because he was English, nay even from the East End of London. It was entertaining to see over that year people’s opinions gradually change, until finally it seemed almost all sentient West Ham fans had witnessed enough of his boring football, along with his dour TV personality, and his footballing philosophy which amounted to nothing more than staying in the league or constantly saying he was ‘stabilising the ship’.

So when he finally walked, ironically because the clubs technical director Nani had sold two average players, and replaced them with a much better midfielder and defender, I was the first person cheering and relieved that we could now get back to showing the ambition that the club finally deserved, and appoint a manager that would be an attractive prospect for players to play for, and one that I could wholeheartedly get behind and support.

In came Gianfranco Zola, and although I was as surprised as anyone else at the choice, I at least thought that world class players may be attracted by the prospect of playing for him, and thought that if his winning mindset could rub off, and his contacts be utilised, that the future would be brighter than under Curbs.

Now people are raving on about Zola’s exploits, and the new players that he has at his disposal, thanks to Nani’s wheeling and dealing and the academy graduates coming of age. And it is regularly reported that Curbs bought a load of lemons and wasted the money and resources that were initially pumped into the club. Now that’s where I draw the line, although many of the same people that were supporting Curbs, are now slating him, I do acknowledge that his purchases were actually very shrewd. They were also necessary in keeping the team in the Premier League at the time, and it could be agued that he didn’t pay over the odds, when you compare the purchase prices with those of Spurs, or other clubs.

Bellamy – his class is not in question, Champions League experience, a potent striker, he brought a goal scoring edge and pacey dynamic that the team has since sorely missed. He was chased by quite a few clubs and later sold on for nearly double the fee paid for him.

Upson – became an England international and must again be worth at least double the fee we paid for him, and among the best centre- halves in the Premier League.

Parker – one of the best defensive midfielders in the league who again could have been sold for more than double the fee paid for him, and was chased by many clubs, during the January transfer window.

Neill – Although suspect at times, with his shirt tugging and lack of speed, has been a steadying influence in the team and at times shown the worth of his transfer fee.

Dyer – No doubt the ability to win games with his speed, creativity and eye for goal. Also an England international when fit, and at least worth the fee paid and could prove a bargain if he doesn’t get injured 

Boa Morte – The boo boys are starting to choke on their pies, as he is showing that he is well worth the fee paid for him and adds speed and attacking options to the team.

Cole – Ok Curbs didn’t buy him, but when many fans would have had him sold and shipped off to Canvey Island, Curbs kept him and saw and developed his potential, which he is now beginning to realise.

Now onto Curb’s relatively small number of doubtful purchases.

Quasie – I can’t defend this one – Enough said.

Ljungberg – Was bought for a very small fee, apparently very high wages though, not sure if he was past his best – we’ll never know.

Davenport – bought for a smallish fee, the club should be able to recuperate most if not all of it back, and for the record played well for the team when Collins/ Upson was injured.

If people require further proof of Curbs ability to identify good talent, he also tried to purchase Ashley Young and Darren Bent among others whose, attacking and goal scoring talents are not in doubt.

When people blame Curbs or the Eggmeister for allowing inflated wages, lets remember it was one of the few tools of leverage the club had at their disposal at that time – and so was justified. Why else would top quality players joined a team fighting against relegation?

So, Curbs although I didn’t think you were the right manager for the long term (or even the short tem), I do acknowledge this, that the players that you identified, tried to purchase and did purchase were overall very good! Good luck in your next job mate!

Hotshot C

31 comments:

Anonymous said...

This is not my favourite site but this is indeed a very good article.

Curbishley was the manager that kept us up. Please don't forget that and we done well last season with many injuries.

Not great football, but I would much rather beat Chelsea on Saturday in a poor game 1-0 (disputed goal as well) than take part in the best game of the season and lose 4-2!

Good luck Alan.

TrevorH

Hammersfan said...

Sorry mate, I posted it because I will not censor opinions on this site, but I have to disagree. Curbishley's signings, Neill apart, did nothing to keep us in the Prem. Upson only played 40 minutes during the Great Escape and we lost both games! Quashie played in 7 games and we didn't win one of them! Boa-Morte only featured for the full 90 minutes in five games and was otherwise used as a sub or pulled off - we only won one game in which he played for the full 90 minutes, (away to the already crowned Mancs) - and, of course, he only scored one goal despite being bought as a goal scoring inside left / wide player. Davenport played in 6 games and we lost all of them except one, which we drew 2-2 (so the defence was hardly waterproof even then!) That is a dreadful record given approximately £20million was spent!

Hammersfan said...

TrevorH, you are still visiting! That's where we part as fans mate. I am a true West Ham fan, raised under Greenwood and Lyall to respect the values that our club stands for; you are just like Blackburn, Bolton and Stoke fans - get the points at any cost! You are welcome on the site and you wear a West Ham scarf but your soul is not claret and blue!

apache said...

I never wanted Curbs, but I continuously supported him, right up until the end.

Granted, I didn't enjoy the footy, but I accepted that the injuries played a big part in that - also for the record, I DON'T blame him for the injuries. If you look at physioroom.com, you will see that Charlton consistently had some of the lowest injuries whilst he was in charge. People forget that a whole new training pitch was laid the summer before and that's when our injuries started piling up.

As for Zola... right now he is fantastic. But let's not forget, it was a MASSIVE gamble.

I think KUMB did a poll just before his appointment and he was last out of the choices with less that 1% of the vote.

West Ham got lucky with Zola, very very lucky.

I can't think of a single manager EVER, that has turned around a teams playing style as quickly as Zola. I still have my reservations about his lack of experience, hopefully Steve Clarke will continue by his side for years to come.

Fanno, I think Curbs HAS to take some credit for keeping us up. Just look at Derby and Jewell last season. That is what you call a dour uninspiring manager! If Curbs was a terrible manager, the team would have capitulated a long time before. I know that you hate the guy, I would hope that not winding people up will have mellowed you out a little!

Hammersfan said...

Apache mate, you know I don't rate the guy and know I have a loooooonnnngggggggg memory as far as Turds is concerned. Had the linesman not given the goal that never was against Blackburn, we would have sunk without trace. Turds was lucky, nothing more!

Anonymous said...

Maybe the players didn't figure in a big way in the relegation battle, but I do agree there were some decent players bought, that could be/ have been sold on for a bigger fee... When you look at the spuds that spend 20 million on one player curbs did well to buy half a team with that amount....

michael maisonpierre said...

Exhibit A, regarding Curbishley's shrewd eye for talent: Carlos Tevez, sitting on the subs' bench.

Hammersfan said...

LOL mmpierre!

Hotshot C said...

mmaisonpierre - Carloz Tevez you may remember was played in the relegation run in and scored quite a few goals to keep West Ham up... He wasn't played at first because you may remember he was out of shape and quite a bit more plump than he was in the run in and how he looks now playing for man u.....

Hammersfan said...

What about my point Hotshot mate?

Anonymous said...

You know what without curbs and the icelanders we would have gone down no doubt under terry brown and Alan pardew. They all done a great job however they done it as we survived. Dont be slagging off curbs now as he turned the hammers around after the most turbulent time in our history. Dont get me wrong Zola and Clarke are doing amazing but im sure the idiot who writes these stories and slagged off half the team and curbs or Turds as he called them is just writing this story so he doews not look like a total negative twat. We need to get behind players like LBM who battle their hearts out for the team and not just slag them off as it is fashionable. The 2 players who deserve no support are Quashie and Tristain who is just awful and not up to the premiership. The rest deserve all our support.

Hotshot C said...

I give you that one, that the players didn't play a big part in keeping the team up, but the fact new players were brought in at least perked up players that were just lazy 'bentley boys'... The main point I was trying to make is that the players he bought would make a profit if all were sold, and on that alone it could be argued that they weren't lemons (as many people on forums seem to accuse him of).... As I said I wasn't his greatest fan, but credit where credit's due... At least he showed ambition trying to by young & bent and buying Bellamy - a bit more than Di Michele & Tristan...:-)

Hotshot C said...

anonomous 17.17 - fanno didn't write the article so he's not writing it "to not look like a negative tw*t" , as it was written by me, and submitted by him....

CelticHammer said...

Funnily enough I emailed something recently to Hammerfan which dealt in part with my opinion of curbs. Hopefully he will post it soon but in the mean time I couldnt disagree more with any effort to label curbishley anything other than a terrible choice of manager.
The reason be bought, Neill, Parker, Upson, Dyer et all is he simply has to buy from the premiership (or in a couple of cases the championship) as he has no knowledge of continental football. It doesnt take a svengali of football to pay big money for people with premiership experience. It does take a little intelligence to carry out a medical or to notice that a player turned up in an ambulance and not a bentley to sign his contract.
Curbs had next to nothing to do with The Great Escape, the players and the fans had a damn site more to do with it. Curbs just picket the 11 players he had fit and crossed his fingers hoping for a miracle.
Last season was the most depressing I have ever endured as a Hammers fan. Due to work committments I usually end up flying in the day of or the day before a game. I usually enjoy this, it gives me a chance to catch up on team news, read some forums and I normally have a couple of games stored on the laptop to watch on the flight or flights!
Last season I must have looked like a guy awaiting extradition sitting in airports on my way to Upton Park. The depression would set in around thursday and by the time kick off arrive on saturday I would have the Samaritans on speed dial.
Even in games where we were getting thumped I never want the final whistle to go, under curbs I was calling for it before the ball left the centre circle at kick off.
Those players who he bought (or in Coles case played week in week out) only blossomed after Zola took over.
The only thing worse than the football we played were the cringe worthy excuses he trotted out in post match interviews about injuries and bad luck.
To make matters worse he cant keep his mug off TV taking credit for everything that is happening at WestHam at the moment, funny he doesnt do the same with Charlton. On top of all of that he is sueing the club for £1Million which pretty much sums the guy up in my eyes.

Hotshot C said...

Hi fanno, apologies for the duplicates, my computer froze & went AWOL...:-)

Hotshot C said...

Celtichammer - i would be the firat to admit that i felt like hanging myself everytime i watched a match under curbs (although there was a spurs & arsenal match that were exciting) some credit needs to go to curbs for the players he bought, u can't give it all to Zola... And Zola or Nani need to put their hands up to the two impotent strikers they bought in - DDM & Tristian....

CelticHammer said...

HotshotC I posted a piece about my trip to Villa last weekend and I said that watching Diego Tristan play and score for WestHam will always be a very special memory. I also commented on my opinion of how he played. As for DiMichele, I met some Palermo fans when we played them in the UEFA cup a couple of seasons back, they took myself my cousin and my mate on the beer and I have stayed in contact with a few of them. I have even been over to a game there with them last season. When we signed DiMichele I asked what they thought of him and they love the guy.
He hasnt played in his natural role for us which is between the midfield and the main striker. He is pushed further forward as Noble had been playing at the point of the diamond in midfield for most of the season. That said you can not fault his workrate or that the guy has shown some exquisite skill at times. Remember that it was his two touches against villa that set up the goal of the season for us.

Hammersfan said...

Celtic mate, I've found one article which went in to trash for some reason. I will post that either tonight or tomorrow. Haven't I run a Curbishley article from you?

CelticHammer said...

Hammersfan I dont think so mate. I resent them both to you, the second one is not a curbs article but one about BG and the club in general. As for curbs I could wear out the keys on my laptop writing about what a muppet that guy is!

Hammersfan said...

LOL. If you would like to write a grand opus on the Turds Era, I'd be happy to run it! When you are over, it would be good to meet for a beer with Hotshot and a few others from on here if they were interested.

Hotshot C said...

Celtic - it's interesting that you made the comment about DDM being an attacking midfielder as I had thought he would probs work better in that role (a little like benayoun), this said why is he be played as a striker? & with Tristian? It's like watching 'the mighty ducks' or some American wild geese story of no hopers & rejects becoming the 'A Team'.... But we all know tv stories for teens doesnt translate into reality :-)

Anonymous said...

I 100% agree that when curbs left i was relieved as the football most of the time was dull to say the least but he did play a big part in keeping us up as just look at charlton when he left. The guy is a steady safe manager that will always get you just about mid table. When he left it was exciting as i hoped for a more dynamic manager and in Zla although not most peoples first choice at least the gut has an aura about him and he played amazing football so i was quite happy. Some of the football we have played this season has been quality and the players seem to love Zola and i can asure you they do as Rob lee is related to me and his son Oli loves the man as he is so genuine. But saying all this you cant rubbish the job Curbs done as he kept us up and as for the compensation then so what anybody forced out of their job would follow the same route going for compo. I hope he doesnt get it but if he does then he is probably owed it even if he doesnt deserved it.

CelticHammer said...

Anon 18.29 my problem with curbs is he was telling everyone how happy he was when Nani was appointed and with the vision laid out by BG and Dux for the club. Then he walks out when Anton and Linda are sold. To be honest with the money on the table for them both it would have been crazy to turn it down. I think curbs knew he couldnt do the job the fans wanted and took the oppertunity to use the sale of players as a chance to walk.

Hotshot C said...

Celtic - Are you saying that Savio, DDM & Tristan are better than Curb's choice of strikers: Bellamy, Young & Bent?

CelticHammer said...

HotshotC its all well and good curbs wanting bellamy, young and bent but he only managed to land ballamy and thats because liverpool were fed up of him and he was surplus to requirements. In the case of bent we supposedly offered him more money than spurs and curbs still couldnt convince him to come.
DDM was signed by nani on deadline day because curbs had failed to land striking cover after he and nani fell out over seb pinto.
As for Savio I think the kid has massive potentional and in Zola and Clarke he has a much better chance of realising that than he would have under curbs.
As for Tristan, I have seen him play in smoe reserve games this season and he has been fantastic for the yongster to play along side. In the first reserve match with chelski the guy was red hot. At the villa game you could see that his legs just simply wouldnt do what he told them to do. His goal was pure class and I think he will put in a good sihft against chelski this weekend. Is he the player he was? No! Of course not! He is past his prime but we couldnt have afforded him when he was in his prime. He was signed when the window was closed as he was a free agent and we desperately needed cover.
I rate DDM and I know we have not seen the best of him. His natural role is as a link player behind a target man. Unfortunately he has had to play with Cole whos positional sense is woeful, though improving slightly. I have watched some of their games together and you can see that Cole's lack of natural instinct has meant he isnt where DDM expects him to be. You can see his talent when we break as he keeps these breaks going and rarely allows them to break down. He is crucially involved in almost ever counter attack goal we score. He has super technical ability which can only benefit our younger players from seeing in training. He loves his football and I always have a softspot for players like that. I think his workrate is commendable and his willingness to try things in a team that has sometimes looked a little short of flare is the sign of someone who has self belief. I also think he will be at the club next season and while I doubt Tristan will I look forward to telling my little nephew about the time I saw him score for us at Villa Park. Hammersfan, I am Irish I never say no to a pint!

Hammersfan said...

When are you over next? I will try to organise something. Coming over for the Boro game?

CelticHammer said...

Hammersfan I will be at the Heineken Cup final that weekend hopefully supporting Munster but if not I will grudgingly cheer for Leinster! Right now the only home game I have a chance of making is the liverpool one and that is doubful as I have a wedding on the Friday. It looks like my last game of the season will be Everton away. Will let you know in time to get the beers in if anything changes.

michael maisonpierre said...

Hotshot C: Yes, I remember something about Tevez scoring goals near the end of that season...

My point about Curbishley was that he lacked the imagination to put Carlitos in prior to that. When he finally put him in it was out of a lack of any better ideas; Tevez tells it that he pointed out to Curbishley during one match that maybe, Senor, I should go into the game as all the fans are singing for me?
When Tevez finally went in it was like a cork out of champagne. He alone on that team understood how to play the game without only worrying about how not to lose, which is the dreary hallmark of that West Ham era. Tevez might have been out of shape when he arrived, but he could have started that finaly miraculous run a lot sooner.

Hotshot C said...

mmaisonpierre - Tevez played quite a few games before the final run in and due to unfitness and taking time to acclimatize to the English game wasn't actually much use, remember Pardew playing him/ and beginning of Curb's reign? I didn't enjoy Curbs defensive unimaginative managing either - the main point that was being made is that the players he bought were pretty good and have shown that they can compete at the top of the league...

Anonymous said...

I think the article is a pretty good one and very fair. I was quite happy when Curbs was appointed as he was one of our own and I respected what he did at Charlton. By then of course, too many of our fans had become hooked on the idea that we were going to be a Top 4 side and expected us to get Jose Mourinho or similar rather than the guy whose claim to fame was keeping Charlton in the Premiership. Some people love to have a go at him for playing boring football but having managed myself, at a much lower standard, I know that when the majority of your best players are out injured you simply cannot play open attacking football. That was Curbs mistake but was it a mistake? I don't think we'd have been grateful for him playing attacking football and losing every week so he was screwed if he did and screwed if he didn't. His survival instincts meant he played the way he did at Charlton and that wasn't good enough for most West Ham fans but you have to give him credit for keeping us up and finishing in mid-table. I have no doubt that he could have stepped up his tactics had he had the chance but that's speculation. No matter what I say some West Ham fans will forever hate the guy but they are the sad ones unable to give credit where it's due. And how can anyone blame Curbs for spending transfer money when Eggy was freely handing it around? Who blames Mark Hughes for spending money at Man City? Was it Curbs that agreed Ljungberg's wages? Of course not - it was Eggy. And what gave Eggy the idea his fellow countryman was happy to spend whatever it took? BG? Zola has been a bright young manager with honesty, integrity and a style about him that we all love. However, no-one criticises Zola when half our first choice players are out injured but they did Curbs. No-one blames Zola for signing Lopez (Curbs had actually said no to Lopez), Tristan and DiMichele but they did Curbs for his signings. No-one blames Zola for wasting £9m on Savio when we urgently needed a forward to replace Bellamy. (I'm sure Savio will be a good signing but eventually...) Curbs was badly treated by our club. If BG did not want him to stay he should have just paid him off instead of breaking his employment contract. We were lucky in many respects after Curbs left. We got lucky with Zola and Clarke. We got luckier with injuries. We got lucky that several promising youngsters are maturing at the right time and we got lucky that the league is weaker than last year. Our points total this year would have put us in 10th place. Once Curbs has his settlement I am sure he will find a new club without any problem and I wish him well, thanks for a decent job which allowed Zola to move us on a stage further.

Hotshot C said...

Anon 12.15, agree with you about DDM, Tristan, Lopez & Savio... A vital error not replacing Bellamy with a striker? And how gutted will the club be spending 9 million on Savio if Stanislas is as good a player....