Wednesday 29 April 2009
BG - The case against.
The following article has been submitted. The Blog Administrator wishes to make clear that the site does not validate anything in this article. In the interest of balance following the article in support of BG, this submission has been carried.
The negative responses to the recent article praising BG shows what most of us long suffering fans think of our Chairman. BG is lucky to have the persona of a gentleman billionaire that has merely been unfortunate in the credit crunch but, I found an article in 1st November 2002 Euromoney Magazine, under the heading “Questions Over Landsbanki's New Owner” that changed my mind about him. It says that BG has a criminal record and has been bankrupting companies by his mis-management since the mid-80s. His business life has been littered with numerous lost law suits and disasters of one kind or another simply because he is a bad businessman and should not be allowed near any company IMO. I have never met BG so it is not personal. I am merely a fan that wants the best for our club!
BG first came to international attention when he was found to have misled the shareholders and bankers of Hafskip, an Icelandic shipping line he was MD of in the mid-80s. Euromoney says that he twice issued false accounts to reassure shareholders and banks that Hafskip was operating profitably. Hafskip went bust a few months later in December 1985. The bankruptcy forced an Icelandic bank to be closed which sounds all too familiar today but this was in 1985! BG was arrested and remanded in custody for 28 days in 1986 so he is actually an ex-jailbird!
He was eventually found guilty of “embezzlement of company bank accounts,” to have “violated articles of the Companies Act” and also violated “The General Penal Code over several counts of embezzlement, two of which involved fraud.” He got a 12month prison sentence suspended for two years. This is a classic, early demonstration of BG's cavalier attitude to business matters.
After the disaster of Hafskip, BG and his son Thor, turned up in the new capitalist Russia, with it's reputation for corruption and largely unregulated commercial activity. They got involved in building up a bottling plant, which they sold to Pepsico. Euromoney say “They developed a flair for working their way around the viper's nest of customs, regulatory and tax authorities.” I wonder what that means? Then they invested in a brewery in St Petersburg and Moscow, Bravo International, which they built up with two partners, one English and the other an Icelander, eventually selling to Heineken for $400m in 1995! Of more relevance to us is the fact that their two partners claimed in law suits, that BG and Thor had forged their signatures on documents to cheat them out of their full share of the $400m sale. BG and Thor finally lost in an Icelandic court on 6 December 1999!
After the sale to Heineken, BG and Thor then invested in a long established Icelandic pharmaceuticals company, Pharmaco (now renamed Actavis); Straumur Burdaras, an investment bank run by Thor that eventually went under just last month, and Landsbanki which the Icelandic Government sold off in 2002. The business community were surprised and a lot of serious questions were raised about whether the Iceland government were right to sell their bank to a convicted criminal with a dubious past but Iceland is a small community of 320,000 people not the UK! Landsbanki went bust just 6 years later under BG! One of the most incredible disasters that I still don't fully understand, came when BG gave guaranties for our sponsors XL.com to help them secure a £163m loan from another bank just a couple of days before XL called in the receivers! That episode clearly helped finish off Landsbanki as they were re-nationalised days after that debacle!
Most of us first heard about BG when he bought West Ham using Eggert Magnusson as his front man presumably because of his own 'colourful' past. I was one of the many fans that thought our bubbles would at last, no longer fade and die! Terrence Brown was no longer in charge and we gained a billionaire that was going to invest big time in Eggy's much heralded business plan for a new 60,000 seat stadium and Champions League football within 5 years. It sounded unbelievable and that's exactly how it turned out - unbelievable!
The first disasters happened on the playing side and it soon became clear that the business plan was behind schedule. Eggy sacked Pardew and appointed Curbishley to complete indifference amongst fans. Curbs was not a bad manager, just that Champions League and Curbishley, don't quite go together somehow. A lot of non-Champions League players were bought for £40m and we all know that we got out of the relegation zone at Old Trafford, on the final day of the season with mainly the existing players. It seems that Eggy had been given no limits to his spending authority which is most unusual. BG should have imposed tighter controls but the kind of expertise he has, was honed in Iceland and Russia, not the UK.
Eggy then hit the exit door fairly soon afterwards and he has since issued a high court action against us. Zola replaced Curbs after he walked out over the Ljungberg settlement and Anton and McCartney transfers. Curbs claimed they were all done behind his back in spite of him having a contract giving him the final say on all transfers. He has sued us for constructive dismissal. BG showed incredible insensitivity and if he wanted Curbs out, he should have done the decent thing and paid him off but that isn't his way it seems. Zola has certainly been a saving grace for the club and his sparkle and drive always cheers me up but was he an inspired choice or just a cheaper alternative to Curbs? We'll never know but it is about the only thing that has worked out OK.
During BG's two year ownership we have been found guilty of lying to the Premiership about the existence of an illegal side agreement with Kia Joorabchian. The lies got WHUFC fined £3m and breaking the rule itself, just £2.5m! Had we told the truth and pleaded mitigating circumstances – eg previous owner's fault just the way Alan Sugar did when he took over Tottenham, it would have cost £2.5m. We would have sorted out the Tevez contract properly and there would not have been a Tevezgate scandal that has cost us incredible amounts of money and ruined the club's reputation. We have now had 3 managers when in the previous 107 years we got by with only 9! The five year £1m pa contract Terry Brown negotiated for himself as part of the sale to BG, was canceled, presumably in an attempt to make him the scapegoat for the Tevez affair. We now know that the club lied though, because a copy of the side agreement was printed in the News of the World exposé a few months ago. BG must have approved Duxbury's lies to the Premiership or he would surely have gone through the exit door as well. Brown added himself to the list of people suing us and BG settled out of court because he was wrong and knew Brown was not going to let it go. I have little sympathy for Brown who made millions out of our club but it was just another example of BG's shady dealings that litter his entire business history.
Even Kia Joorabchian sued us for non payment of a £7m contract secretively arranged to keep Tevez playing apparently! Kia's settlement is that he is now our transfer consultant for as long and as much as it costs for BG to keep him quiet. It's a shame BG never thought to employ Kia's lawyer as well so that he could not give his damning evidence to the FA hearing! Verbal cuddles Duxbury called it and the fact that he hasn't been sacked or shafted like Brown, Eggy, Kia and Curbs, suggests Duxbury has been operating under BG's direction since he took over. Tevez has now reputedly cost us around £26m spread across the next 5 years plus millions in legal fees and it could have been even worse! It could have put us into administration.
The May 2008 accounts have been delayed from being filed for 6 months beyond the deadline allowed for PLCs! Normally you cannot do that but BG used a little known rule to twice change our year end date by a few days each time so that we were given the extra time to sort out the accounts. We have the weird situation that our financial year will now end on the 24th May! The reason? Our auditors would not sign off our accounts or in layman's terms, they would not confirm that BG's version of our accounts were an accurate reflection of the year's trading!
I believe that the auditors insisted on putting in a large provisional sum for Sheffield United's compensation. Our auditors have a world-wide reputation to protect and clearly the size of provisional sum they demanded for the compensation payment would have pushed us into filing insolvent accounts and that would put us into administration. Those 6 months of delay gave BG time to settle with Sheffield United and even better, spread it over 5 years to minimize the impact in any one year. We can now belatedly file the 2008 accounts with an accurate provisional sum that should allow the accounts to remain solvent. For that reason, I have a feeling that our club actually may not have done anything wrong to deserve having to pay the compensation but, the auditors demands forced us to settle with Sheffield United or go bust! That's unfortunate but a direct result of BG having no credibility left with auditors and bankers. We will only find out if I am right, if the final hearing decides we did nothing wrong and it gets publicly announced.
All BG's companies, except Actavis, are now busted. Even Actavis has troubles and in 2008 lost an American law suit for patent infringements and have been forced to withdraw a particular brand of tablet from all outlets across the USA due to contravening the Food and Drug Administration's regulations! Sound familiar? As I said law suits seem to follow them around. They put Actavis up for sale this year for €8 billion but the highest bids did not clear the €4+billion in bank loans they owe! Imagine the interest and capital payments on €4+billion in loans every year? Then add in the costs of a product recall and losing a big legal battle in America. A cost of close to €750m I imagine. Ouch!
The banks that lent BG money for buying West Ham, have already threatened to take our club over once the Icelandic version of chapter 11 protection on Hansa's bankruptcy ends in June. I cannot see the banks going through the trouble to take us over for any other reason than they want to protect their interests by keeping the loans on their books as assets rather than being in default as they are currently. I hope I am wrong but if the banks do take us over, then expect them to try to load the £100m they are owed, directly onto our club instead of BG's bankrupt holding company. According to the Mail on Sunday a week ago, our club's borrowings have increased to £50m under BG so that means we would carry a total debt for around £150m! Thanks BG.
Whatever kind of spin anyone puts on it, BG has not been good for our club. His ownership of many companies shows a history of broken contracts, failed litigations, bad decisions, dodgy settlements and bankrupted companies. I don't think anything has really changed since Terence Brown's days as our Chairman, except we are now actually worse off financially; our good name has been dragged through the mud; we get sued all the time; have up to £10m a year to pay out in fines and settlements for the next few years and we could still end up getting lumbered with debts of up to £150m. We are still a selling club with survival as our main ambition despite Duxbury's Project and there is only one man that can take the wrap for all this – the man at the top.
Let's all cross our fingers that we find a new owner very soon. I don't believe any real West Ham fan wants an Abramovich or a wealthy Arabian trillionaire throwing money around like they do at Chelsea and Man City. We just want someone that gives us some stability and Zola and Nani a fighting chance in the transfer market. Maybe some future investment into developing the East Stand and the new training ground? Not much really is it?
Is there anyone out there with £200m to invest in a very good cause?
Billbanksy
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36 comments:
I wouldn't mind an Abramovitch or Man city style bankroll for the club... Or at least a Randy Lerner... With a decent transfer kitty (on par with Aston Villa or Spurs), I think we could be a top four side - with Zola, Nani & Clarke... Regarding it all being the bad villain BG (in a pantomime kind of way), the club has a history of dodgy dealing and shady things going on, it didn't start with BG and let's remember that it was Brown & Duxbury that bought in Tevez & Mascherano knowing that it was dodgy... In all this, the club did stay in the premier league, with the help of Tevez and the cash pumped in for players, so all in all it worked as means to an end... And the good news is that BG's bringing in Nani, Zola & Clarke has set us up for a stable future, and with a bit more investment a successful one - let's be honest most of the foreign owners that have bought UK clubs have a shady past (Abramovitch, Man city's original owner etc...), be glad that the Hammers are still a premier league club and will most probably never be the yoyo club again...
This has simply taken a hatchet piece from Euromoney and edited it accordingly to make an even more daming case. Let me tell you how things work mate.
Before I get into the nitty gritty I would like to point out that the plan to play Champions League football included making Europe through the UEFA Cup (now Europa League) this season. We are on course to do so.
Now as for BGs trial in Iceland he was convicted along with a number of other company officals of book-keeping irregularities. For those who want to actually know what happened and not take the side of some hack journo or some misguided fan (I am doing you a favour leaving it there pal) try reading this
http://www.islandia.is/ornolfur/Hafsk.htm
That is an account of the whole affair from begining to end by a respected Icelandic historian. I have enquired extensively about BG and his background and it has been said to me that he and others accepted their fate in order to save Iceland suffering an even bigger scandal which would have ripped the government apart. On a quick point for those who dont read it of 450 charges brought against the defendants only 5 were proven and those were suspect to say the least.
Ok now on to Moscow. I am guessin the author of this piece has never been there, if he had he would know that you can not get a taxi from your hotel without paying off the doorman and then you will only get one driven by a cabbie who is also paying off the doorman, he will then in turn only try to take you to restaurants or bars or clubs where he is getting paid by their doorman for the buiness. Corruption is endemic in Russia. It should be pointed out however that when Thor and BG were trying to launch the beer rather than giving in to the demands of local mafia figures for pay offs to make sure things went well or venues didnt accidentally double book a launch party, or caterers forget to bring food, they simply organised a free street party for 10,000 people and gave them free beer all night. It should also be noted that a company like Heiniken do not buy corrupt or suspect companies of and if there was any validity to the claims made by former partnets about forged signatures the deal would have fallen foul of due dilligence.
Lets move onto Actavis shall we? Actavis today resumed production at is facility in the US having been completely cleared by the american FDA and will shortly be back up to full production in New Jersey. Again dont take my word for it read this
http://www.newsinferno.com/archives/5673
Oh and another thing, Actavis recently signed a deal with the Japanese government to supply 30% of all the generic drugs used by the Japanese health service (arguably the finest in the world). The recent sale was put on hold due to the fact that none of those parties interested in buying the company could raise the capital in the current climate to buy the company as it was simply too big. The considered opinion was that whilst the valuation was considered agressive it was the right thing to do to withdraw it from sale until such time as market conditions improved. Check Reuters if you dont believe me
http://www.reuters.com/article/marketsNews/idUSLG14136620090416?rpc=401&
Landsbanki! A bank failed, well technically no. Technically the Icelandic government nationalised it, if we are to say it failed did RBS fail? Did Northern Rock fail? How much of a bank does a government have to own before it is considered failed? And at any point did the Icelandic governement say that depositors would not get their money back? The problem was that due to the collapse of Giltner and Kaupthing (whom the finance minister tried to get Landsbanki to take over) caused a massive panic in Iceland. Landsbanki is the bank of choice for over 2 thirds of the Icelandic public and the government feared that a run on the bank would end up crippling the country, it was therefor decided to nationalise the bank to restore public confidence and essentially save the country from disaster. Foreign depositors were initially excluded from discussions about getting deposits back until such time as the Icelandic public had calmed down. It should be noted that the bank had trippled its profits in 2007 compared to 2006 and had been performing strong in 2008 prior to the collapse od the US subprime mortgage market.
As for Hansa it is not bankrupt it is in administration. There is a significant difference. Its creditors are happy to work with BG and the existing board to ensure its recapitalisation and recover their investments. It looks like they will exchange the debts for shares, not something you tend to do with a company thats going bankrupt.
As for WestHams accounts, BG couldnt convince the auditors that the blunts bogus claim was going to be settled in our favour. Remember what we did or didnt do has nothing to do with their claim, we were punished for that, £5.5M in fines was our punishment. BG was forced to come to a deal or the company would have been put into administration for failing to file its accoutns, not because it was insolvent. The irony of the whole thing is that we will probably end up writing the fine off against tax due to the increased profits the club will post for the last couple of seasons (this one included). Also it looks like the blunts will be on the end of their own compensation claim after their captain Chris Morgan assaulted Iain Hume and cost Barnsely (rememebr he was their big summer signing) not only any chance of pushing for promotion but possibly their Championship status.
http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/football/Survival-will-not-stop-Cryne.5215719.jp
For any Tykes fan reading this please let me know of any fighting fund and you can count me in for a contribution to the cause. The actual real figure of the compensation when all write offs are taken into account will be less that £5M, a drop in the ocean of relegation would have caused us.
I have already dealt with the footballing side in a recent article so I wont go over old ground here. To the author of this piece may I suggest trying to research your article with more than one source. Particularly if that source is an editorial hatchet piece no doubt inspired by a vested interest. I would look at that months print edition and see who the major advertisers were before believing every word of such a one sided load of crap.
Now is BG an innocent babe in arms? Am I blinded by his genial demeanor and quite frankly excellent hair? No. There is an old saying I have always found to be true "Behind every great fortune lies at least one illicit act!"
I may actually write a bio piece on BG soon.
To those lookin at Ambramovitch as the type of owner we want, think again. Go look up his background and see where the bodies are buried ( and I mean that quite literally, look especially to his fued over alluminium produciton in Siberia in the 90s). As for Citeh, do you want a club subject to the whims of an owner with no grounding in football who treats it like a plaything? As for Randy Learner, if he fails with his 7yr plan (the words of keith harris not me) then Villa are in serious trouble. The deal is built around increasing thev value of their global media and image right by securing regular CL football, thats why O'Neill was told to ditch the UEFA cup to concentrate on the league when it looked like Arsenal were vunerable. Learner needed to leverage a new finance deal by selling the rights to an early CL campaign.
Thanks for your reply CelticHammer but can I say it wasn't "simply" anything. It actually took a lot of time to research and I stand by what I wrote. All your references to links merely confirm that what I said was largely correct. The Euromoney article wasn't a hatchet piece and seemed somewhat understated due to potentail libel laws IMO. Are you BG's mate or a personal PR man then? You seem to be defending him with an unusual vigour to write such a lengthy denial of what is after all true? I have an open mind on it and would be glad to see a complete denial but you haven't exactly proved me wrong anywhere yet seem to have said an awful lot!
Billbanksy
the reason why celtichammer is defending BG with such "vigour", is he is trying to convince everyone that west ham are actually in good financial shape, or he is trying to convince himself west ham are in good financial shape!!!...which of course is completely untrue....celtichammer is a truely skilled spin doctor, that response above, in light of the truth about BG, warrants you a job in downing street!
Why dont people read the euromoney article for themselves and see if it comes across quite as damming as Billbanksy would have you believe.
http://www.euromoney.com/Article/1002879/Questions-over-Landsbankis-new-shareholder.html
It is also noteworthy that the article is not even attributed to an author, showing just how much fate the writer has in his own piece.
The link I posted to the Hafskip affair was a piece written by one of the most respected social and politcal commentators in Iceland, someone who is a respected play write, tv and media producer and historian. He has no axe to grind just merely wanted to report the facts. Something Billbanksy isnt too interested in!
As for me being a spin doctor? I am not, I have no interest in spin, I just wont stand by and watch a guy who has done his best by the club be dragged over the coals by idiot fans who bleat on about things they obviously know nothing about the charges they are so quick to level at BG.
Anyone who can not see how much better off we are as a club since he took over is an idiot. We are no longer a selling club who have to watch a succession of talent young players move on to so called bigger clubs, our best players are signed to longterm contracts, we have embarked on a football project which is bringing success without sacrificing the values and traditions of the club and we have the most exciting young management team in Europe.
One thing all these pieces slagging BG off have in common is that they offer no alternative apart from a load of crap about hoping some billionaire turns up, buys the club, give Zola £100M and then never again interferes with the running of the club!
very interesting from both celtic hammer and billbanksy. i think with business of the size that these guys deal with there will always be shenanigans that can be interpreted as brilliant or corrupt, depending who's telling the story. add to that the tiny political,family and business environment, the opportunity to get stitched up is quite high. bg and son have survived which to me demonstrates remarkable tenacity and business acumen in the present environment. West Ham going under with the attendant worldwide negative focus is not in their interest. zola,clarke,nani,mature and young squad locked in,the project is looking great to me. i haven't been as positive about our future in 2 decades. COYI!!
Celtic Hammer- would be easier to read shorter replies (please), they are a tad too long :-)
Celtic Hammer- would be easier to read shorter replies (please), they are a tad too long :-)
After reading these articles it reminds me of the strenght of the confrontational system (political & legal). One argument sways that way then the rebutal gives a better picture.
In my opinion BG is the type of owner we want in that he is prepared to go for the big prize and fight his corner when the going gets tough. At the same time knows when he cant win, does the necessary and moves on as with the Magnusson, Tevez & Lungberg problems(seems the same with his business dealings). Compare this to the Cearn and Brown era's when the only ambition was survival.
Pity he cant seem to get over his current financial problems and keep West Ham as I'm sure we would have a ride to remember, although the longer it goes on?
Enjoyed this blog though, thanks to both.
celtichammer are you really alistar campbell?...you surely work in sales or politics! BG has a "colourful" history to say the least, not to mention his countless lies in former business dealings that have been fully exposed...im sure you would have everyone beleive all is hunky dory, no financial worries, and zola ready to foray into the transfer market in afew weeks...
www.guardian.co.uk/football/2009/apr/17/west-ham-united-iceland-banks-zola
Anon Zola has said that he will be in the market for big name transfers this summer so I am inclined to believe him. That article by the way is out of date, the bank in question Straumur has pointed out that it doesnt currently intend to take over the running of the club or seize control of it. They, like the rest of Hansas creditors are happy to continue to work with BG to get the company trading normally again.
the article is less than 2 weeks old! has the financial situation at the club changed considerably sinced then? as for zola saying he will be in for "big name" players i cant see anything of the sort happening...big name players come with big price tags, we cant even submit our accounts on time while BG tries to buy as much time as possible...does anyone really beleive zola is going to be armed with a big war chest in afew weeks?...a dose of reality is needed here chaps.
Anon 13:45 - Have BG and son survived? BG is a busted flush and Thor is having a bad time at Actavis, the sole surviving company from their empire. BG has gone from being a $billionaire to having less than nothing. It wouldn't surprise me if he's got a few mill stashed away in a tax haven somewhere because it seems he's been increasing West Ham's debts for some reason other than signing players!
Billbanksy
So billybanks BG has been increasing the clubs debts and then skimming off the cash! Is that what you are saying? You know you're a moron and dont ever let anyone try and tell you differently.
So BG is currently stealing money from his most high profile asset all the while its holding company is under the administration of the Icelandic courts? Have you any idea how much of an idiot you sound? Obviously not! You're like a terrier with a bone, you got one unatributed article from what is hardly a newswource to rival the FT or Reuters and you are trying to build your entire case on it.
What a prat.
So why dont you outline you're projections for the club. I would love to hear them, I could use a good laugh.
Well what can I say to that CelticHammer? You are taking this far too personally and I have no idea why? Abuse is the last resort of the feeble minded and you certainly excel at that. I'd be happy to be wrong about BG but he has a criminal record for fraud, shafted his partners with forged documents, breaks contracts as a matter of course, lies and cheats with regular monotony and has brought our club close to administration. Tell us all please as you knew all about his record why did you write a eulogy on him and forget to mention his chequered past? What axe do you have to grind mate! And no I wouldn't be surprised to find that he has a tax haven somewhere stashed with money made out of his bankrupted companies and/or West Ham. Of course we will never be sure but if you are such a smart fellow have a look at West Ham's 2007 accounts where a comparison chart on P5 shows the previous 4 years of admin exenses which consistently average £14.75m. Then explain how they suddenly shot up to £24m just 6 months after BG bought us? That's quite an increase!
Billbanksy
why is it whenever celtichammers judgement or view is questioned or not agreed with he begins to throw cheap insults?....he calls the above poster a moron and prat etc, while celtichammer beleives the club are bringing in "big name" players soon, so we must be flush with cash! so flush, we have to delay our accounts being published! "zola said we will have big name players and i beleive him" what zola is told to keep him sweet and what he will get will not be the same thing, and if you beleive otherwise, it is you who is the moron...do you honestly think the club is in good financial shape? really?...i think you are sipping to much sangria in spain or beamish in cork and need to refrain from your petty insults.
As a matter of interest what Zola said was "Don't be surprised if there will be a few signings and hopefully when they come they will take the level of the team even higher." I don't ever remember anyone mentioning "big money signings" except CelticHammer himself. I hope that if we are signing any new players this summer it means we've seen the back of BG!
Anon when someone basis an entire argument on hearsay, rumour, conjectur and complete crap they are an idiot its that simply. I didnt want to over use the word idiot so I called him a moron as well.
I am sick of people running the club down, getting giddy at any problems that arrive. You so called fans constantly attack BG when the guy has done nothing but his best for the club. For years you have pleaded for someone to come in and save the club from Cearns and Brown and when he does you berrate him at every turn. How do you think and prostective buyer would view your actions. Think he would reckon I cant wait to buy this place so muppets like this lot can rubbish my reputation and slag me off on the internet, quick bring me my cheque book I must buy this club so I can bask in the wamth of the fans.
I love how people keep bringing up something that happened 20years ago, something which they show no actual knowledge of, just the need to rehash half truths and rumours.
Billybanks wants BG to respond to these stories? Why the hell should he? What does he owe you or me or any Hammers fan for that matter? Nothing!
He bought the club, got rid of Terry Brown a man you some of you seem to now be missing. Maybe you are nostalgic for the days when it was easier to buy our talented young players than it is to get a kettle from argos. When the likes of spurs cherry picked our players while their fans rubbed our noises in it. We have evn had some numpty lamenting the fact that we have had 3 managers since BG bought the club, maybe we should have kept curbs then just to make sure we only had 2 manager, then we could all have our souls slowly crushed watching the shite he had us playing.
Again I ask for people to tell me what they want from the clubs owners? Look at the owners of any club in the league and see how much better or worse off than them we are. Some people feel obliged to whine and moan no matter what. No sooner do they stop complaining that the club isnt doing well enough in the league than they are off saying we shouldnt try to get into the Europa League as its too far for the club.
If you can not contribute something constructuve to a discussion on the future of the club then dont bother. People like you have no place at Upton Park and no right to wear a claret and blue jersey!
Just to show that I am not the only one who thinks there will be money for signings in the summer should read these
http://www.eastlondonadvertiser.co.uk/content/towerhamlets/advertiser/sport/story.aspx?brand=ELAOnline&category=sportfootball&tBrand=northlondon24&tCategory=sportela&itemid=WeED29%20Apr%202009%2014%3A05%3A56%3A343
and
http://www.tribalfootball.com/west-ham-boss-zola-we-will-buy-top-five-240938
So just wondering are you calling into question the character and integrity of one of the biggest legends of our times?
That is a complete fabrication of anything I've said CelticHammer. Where have I said I want BG to respond to my article? I have said I am happy to be proven wrong but you are not putting up arguments, you are just getting abusive and introducing side issues and moving goalposts yet ignore my questions directed at you. Why not tell us your thoughts on why WHUFC's Admin expenses went up from an average £14.75m to £24m 6 months after BG took over? Tell us all why you knew all about his record and conveniently forgot to mention it when you wrote a eulogy on him? Do you believe BG has no money stashed away in a tax haven then? Why are you taking it so personally? Answer the questions properly and stop making up your own version of my article. What I have said is a matter of record and oh yes - where was your source for the Big Name Signings you've told us about then?
Billbanksy
Oh right! The East London Advertiser and Tribal Football - those two impecable sources of the truth and you have the cheek to lecture me about getting a lot of my information from EuroMoney Magazine! Try the official website where both those sources of yours got the original story and where neither mentions BIG NAME SIGNINGS and neither does the official site. And you called me a prat and a moron was it? Hmmm! How about the other questions then let's see you do a bit better than that!
Billbanksy
Billbanksy, was I aware of what happened with Hafskip, yes I was. I was more aware of what went on than you obviously are seeing as I had researched it thoroughly. As dor the interviews with Zola they are just that interviews, if he was misquoted then I am sure he would have pointed this out by now. Why would Zola, Clarke and so many players have signed long term deals with a club that isnt financially stable or capable of satisfying their ambitions?
As for the increased cost of admin and operating expenses under BG, the club was run appallingly badly under Browne, the increase in running cost reflects bringing the club into line with the cost of running a premiership club of our size. Until I see the latest accounts I well refrain from further speculation abuot the clubs finances but it would be my opnion that the books will show significant improvement on previous seasons.
Does BG have money in tax havens, yes I am sure he has, just like everyother wealth person on earth has. What would you have him do, simoly deposit all his cash in the clubs bank account and walk away.
I am still dying to hear about your alternative for the club.
No CelticHammer that's not good enough. My question was - and I'll use small words to make it easy for you - If you knew about BG's record why didn't you mention it in your article on him? Sorry but you mention the interviews with Zola? - are they the ones that you quoted Big Money Signings from? The interview on the official site never mentioned big signings and neither did your sources like East London Advertiser and Tribal Football? Those impecable organs of the truth? And you're saying Brown ran the club badly and BG now runs it well so it cost us £10m more for his first 6 months of ownership eh? Well, that's one view but I think you've just proved my case pal. And I see you admit he probably has a tax haven but tell me then CelticHammer how did he get the money into a tax haven without Mr Taxman knowing then clever clogs? He must have shifted money around the world and skimmed it off one or more of his companies illegally then? So you do agree with me and BG is a crook that shouldn't be allowed to run any company then. Gee thanks mate! Oh what did you ask for? My alternative for the club? Simple - a new owner that has the club's interests at heart instead of skimming off the money into tax havens.
Billbanksy
Zola said he would be in the market for new signings in the summer to take the club to the next level. Seeing as we are pushing hard for Europe any player to lift us to the next level would have to be a decent signing. All you have is smeantics you pedantic muppet. Go to NewsNow and run a search for Zola and see the numerous articles where he talks about bringing new players to lift the club to the next level.
Any chance you would like to put your name and adress next to your claim that BG is skimming money off the club and putting it into a tax haven? I am sure his lawyers would love to have a chat with you about it. Taking advantage of tax laws and keeping money off shore in tax friendly locations is not a crime but you're to dumb to know that.
Would you like to give us a list of those pople who meet your criteria of a new owner.
As for proving you case all I have proved is that you're an idiot who can not back up a single claim you made, you have never mentioned hafskiip again after I posted the link showing what actually happened.
BG has a dubious business record going back years and years...that is absolutely beyond question! he even has a criminal record to prove it! yet celtichammer will swear blind that black is white...your opinions on finance and football economics have been picked apart on many occasions on this blog...you post entire essays in response, but when it gets down to the nitty gritty you quote tribal football, and even the daily mail! and then resort to insults! you silly boy...when the clubs accounts are posted i hope you have the decorum to plead forgiveness then disappear into the cyber wilderness.
Put your handbags down boys ! Anon 13.45 has it about right, we're going places.UP THE HAMMERS!!
CelticHammer - I have not disputed that we are going to make new signings just that no-one mentioned Big Money Signings except you. And we will hopefully have a new owner in during the summer window to pay for that. As for the tax haven, you admitted he had one. No-one mentioned "tax friendly locations" which is a different thing entirely. Frankly, you are a slippery character that moves the goalposts constantly to suit yourself but I've had my fun. Now I'm bored with playing with you and I hope your classmates enjoy your company because it isn't fit for a football forum.
Billbanksy
Billbanksy you said tha BG is stealing money from the club and stashing it in tax havens so either back it up and post your name and adress with it or admit you have no idea what you're talking about. You either stand by your claim or you dont! Which is it?
celtichammer in a vain atempt to look credible now fixs his absolute attention on 1 point of a wide ranging article...he constantly does this, aswell as move the goal posts to another subject, or just plain old insults....your modus operandi is well known now you plank! everybody has clocked it. slither away to your hole like a good little rat.
wow anon 22.14 arent you tough, threatening people on line! I bet your the toughest guy on ur bebo group! Are you and your myspace buddies gonna sort me out. The point I fixed on was a libellous claim by Billbanks that Bjorgolfur Gudmundsson is STEALING money from the club and STASHING it in illegal tax havens. Thats a pretty big point wouldnt you say?
Much much bigger than billy's harping on about whether the signings Zola spoke about would be classed as big or not! Yet you failed to pick up on that. Funny that!
Still though its nice to know your the toughest anonymous poster on the blog. Pretty soon your gonna end up getting getting your avitars to beat up my avitars.
Let's take care folks. I think some of this is overstepping the mark. I personally wish to disassociate myself from any allegations of illegality.
threats? what threats you jackass?....your pattern is continuing just as i said! i have witnessed you feeble arguments ripped apart on previous posts, and you do exactly what you doing now! you are but a figure of fun and i would urge billbanksy, and other users who contibute not to take this clown celtichammer to seriously, admin published a couple of his "articles" and a combination of that and some recent spanish sun, has let that big old head of his, swell to epic proportions.
Let me try reasoning with you one more time CelticHammer. Facts: 1)BG has convictions for fraud 2) BG was found guilty to having forged his partners signatures on sale documents after 5 years of legal battles, to cheat them out of their share of the sale of their brewery for $400m. 3) Under his chairmanship West Ham have lied to the Premiership which brought about the whole Tevezgate scandal. 4) Under his chairmanship we have broken contracts of and been sued by several people. Now, knowing all that is it reasonable to assume BG has a tax haven with cash stashed away illegally? You said yes it was and I think so too. Can we prove it? Of course not but I know that the Icelandic authorities are having a good go. What I do not understand is that knowing all this, you chose to write a piece eulogising what a good chairman he is! You have then tried to discredit my article on spurious grounds and then get abusive. When your attempt at ridicule fails you aggressively move the goalposts and try to score points that are just so pointless - like ridiculing my my sources to then use Tribal Football and East London Advertiser as yours! And finally do you really expect me to publish my name and address on the internet with all the attendant possibilities for identity theft? What is it all for? You like BG and I wish he would just go. We are both West Ham fans and want the best for our club but it is for others to judge who is right and who is wrong because we will probably never find out the real truth as a new owner will come in and BG will soon be forgotten.
Billbanksy
BG has convictions for bookeeping offenses not fraud how may times does that have to be explained to you. There is no way a company like Heineken would fail to spot a legitimate case of forgery in their due diligence. Or are you also saying that Heineken willingly participated in a fraudulent transaction? The Tevez scandal was brought about by the origianl deal which was sanctioned by terry brown. What happend afterwards was a result of BG doing everything possible to keep the club in the premier league. The premier league felt that the offence deserved a £5.5M fine, the resulting case by the blunts was only given creedance by some senile 80 year old cricket fan who admitted more than once that he knows nothing about football and took the word of a reporter who was writing the biography of Neil Warnock (what a thrilling read that must be, they should have called it "How to be a whining useless loud mouth, money grabbing northern c*nt!"). Or would you have preferred if he had allowed us to be relegated? I have never said BG has money stashed away illegally! Not once, not ever, you prat! I said that it is likely that BG like all wealthy men has taken advantage of tax laws and probably has money in tax friendly locations. THIS IS NOT ILLEGAL. You obviously lack the intelligence to know the difference. It is only if someone tried to bring money into a country from an off shore location without paying the taxes due does it become illegal. Likewise it is not illegal to move money off shore once all taxes due on it have been paid. People have been establishing off shore trusts for centuries, it is perfectly legal but again you're to thick to know this. As for referencing Tribal Football and the ELA it is simply because the text of Zolas interview is quoted there, I told you to check out newsnow for other sources of the same interview but you havnt bothered.
Face it! You're an idiot.
What is it with BG? He has tried to do his best for the club and even now with idiots like you posting crap about him on the web and making libellous claims about him and hiding behind anonymity he is stil trying to do his best by reducing the cost of season tickets to help fans out in difficult times.
Your claims get more and more ludicrous and you still fail completely to back them up.
Why didnt I mention Hafskip in my piece? Why would I! It doesnt matter a damn, especially when you research what actually went on there. BG has fallen out with people in business? Noooooo! Surely not! I thought he worked at a sunshine, puppy dogs and icecream factory! People in business fall out? This cant be! Surely! Because if you were to read your crap you would think that never in the history of the world has anyone every had a falling out with someone in business! You dont get to be a billionaire without stepping on toes. Pick any billionaire you like and I will happily tell you of occasions where they have been sued, or acted in a manner that could be considered unethical.
Do I want BG to go? No certainly not. Purely for the reason that it will give smug morons like you the belief that you are right.
Celtic. BG has a criminal record for 2 counts of fraud plus another 3 cases of charging his carpets and personal expenses to Hafskip when they were in financial trouble. That's bookkeeping errors are they? He was found guilty in an Icelandic court of forging his partners signatures on share sales that only became apparent after the company was sold to Heineken and they proved they couldn't have been at the board meeting that they were supposed to have sign them because they were out of the country! Brown made the original error signing Tevez but if BG hadn't got Duxbury and co to lie about it then Tevez signature would have been sorted before he started playing regularly and no Tevezgate. Frankly there is no point trying to reason with you because you just twist clear evidence that BG has a crooked record to make him sound like an innocent abroad.
"BG has conviction for book keeping offences not fraud"....that just about sums up celtic "sunstroke" hammer...will i let you in on a little secret?...when you deliberately alter business documents or accounts, in order to conceal or gain, you are commiting a fraudulent act. i understand this will baffle and confuse you. but just keep re-reading this post and it will eventually sink in.
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