Of course, Grant was subjected to race hate after he took over at Chelsea. The Jewish Conspiracy theorists leapt on the fact that Abromovitch was also a Jew, and, like good little Nazis, immediately claimed Grant's appointment was based more on the absence of a foreskin than on the existence of a coaching badge. Chelsea actually stated that some of the protests directed towards Grant constituted abuse of a racist nature, with Bruce Buck claiming they had received points of view which were racist and antiSemitic.
One regular poster on this site labelled Grant a "Zionist" very early doors, although quite what this has to do with his ability to manage the club is beyond me. I accept that Grant's record so far exposes him to criticism, but why were fans ready to stay loyal to Zola for so long, even when it was patently obvious that he was sinking and pulling the club down with him, and yet are now so quick to condemn Grant? It just does not make logical sense.
Remember, we are not Spurs. We don't sack our managers every five minutes. But hang on, that may be the problem for some! Maybe they fear that with Gold owning the club and Grant as manager, we are turning into the "Yids" anyway!
32 comments:
We have a jewish owner, manager and have had more Israeli players come through our doors than any other side in the country. We also have a bloc of fascist fans but on paper we should still pride ourselves on our progression.
Grant can be sacked if hes lost the dressing room end of.
I don't think most fans hate or even dislike Grant or consider his religion to any extent. Most fans I know think he's seems like a decent bloke, as they did with Zola.
For me it's not about the person, it's about the results. I felt exactly the same way about Zola and thought he should have been sacked far sooner than he was.
Quite clearly a provocative article. Is the author racist perhaps? Doth he protest too much?
HF the reason people like zola is because he comes across as a lovely guy. and lets be honest its hard not to like him. with grant its got nothing to do with him being jewish. the reason people dont like him is because he as got to be the most boring person in the world and he looks like doctor death. but im not surprised that your bringing racism in to it again. as you seem to have it on the brain.
Blimey, talk about kick a man when he's down.
Grant has arguably the worst ever managerial record in the PL and you patronise him by suggesting that WH fans don't like him because he's Jewish??
Hilarious but completely deluded.
I can only repeat the statement by the previous commenter:
"Grant has arguably the worst ever managerial record in the PL and you patronise him by suggesting that WH fans don't like him because he's Jewish??"
No need to say any more. But this is typical of what you write lately HF. You are concerned whether Zola was a worse than Grant Manager (I say it is irrelevant), you are urging us to accept relegation and save money for next year!, and now you think that any one cares if Grant is Jewish or not!
The only we care about it to have a bad manager sacked soon enough to save our season. Remember your index by the way? How can you not see how bad and pathetic manager Avram Grant really is?!!!
The season before Grant took over, Chelsea finished second in the Premiership under Mourinho, six points behind Manchester United. Chelsea under Grant finished just two points behind Ferguson's men. Grant's Chelsea also reached the final of the League Cup and final of the Champions League. So, Grant's Chelsea outperformed Mourinho's Chelsea in BOTH the Premier League and the Champions League - and Jose is widely regarded as the best manager in the game. You try stepping into the shoes of a god and outperforming him! In Stani's words, it was Jose's team. The loyalties were to Jose. The anger was turned on Grant. The players didn't want him. the fans didn't want him. But despite everything, Chelsea were MORE successful under Grant in the two major competitions and reached another final into the bargain. Interesting. Why did that happen then?
At Portsmouth, he took over a club with two feet in the grave. Yes they went down, but they were always going down. But strangely, this incompetent manager somehow managed to mismanage them through to an FA Cup Final, defeating a vastly superior Tottenham team, managed by that useless mug 'Arry Redknapp, in the semifinal. Amazing that a useless manager had the luck to see another team through to another Cup Final. Lucky bastard aint he? That's, what, THREE finals in major competitions in less than two full seasons. What a useless tosser this guy is! All the motivational and organisational skills of a used condom obviously!
And here we are at West Ham, in the semifinal of the League Cup. Hmmm. Spent next to nothing. Took over a terrible shambles from Zola. Victim of a less than kind draw which has seen us drawn against three Premiership teams, including the leaders of the Prem, unbeaten in 9 months and holders of the Cup, and yet that incompetent, useless Zionist bastard has, by incredible good fortune, made it through to ANOTHER semifinal. Clearly the guy was born with a four leafed clover birthmark on his arse!
So, improved on Mourinho, three Cup Finals in two seasons, four cup semifinals in two and a half seasons...no idea obviously. Hopeless obviously. It's all luck apparently.
Or he could just be a rubbish manager HF!
Chelsea players said his techniques were ancient. Not me, not Sav, not Comical, but the Chelsea players who worked with him.
His friend Abramovic, who gave him the chance in English football at one of Europe's biggest clubs had to sack him in the end after realising. This was his friend!
You have demonstrated this obsessional type of psychosis before HF, when you couldn't stop blogging about how rubbish Zola was. Now you can't stop blogging about how much you like Grant.
Listen to everyone, let it go. Even G&S are beginning to have a change of heart...but not you.
But I was right about Zola wasn't I?
The thing is, I have no loyalty to Grant. I don't know how good or bad he is. I would have replaced him with Pardew or given Pardew the job in the first place. I would appoint O'Neill if he would join us - but he won't.
I just think it is too soon to judge the man and think we will go down anyway. So I advocate giving him more time. Simple.
You showed your hand when you called him a Zionist Stani. I remain convinced that you are not judging objectively.
And as for the players' criticism. He wasn't Jose so they were never going to like him were they?
I don't believe for a second that the ani Grant-ism has anything whatsoever to do with his faith.
The cup is fantastic, HF and I really would love to see us at Wembley. The fact remains that in the bread and butter week in week out business of getting the points that really cement the longer term reputation of the club (even Millwall got to a cup final recently!) Avram is failing miserably.
Personally, I prefer his team's style and shape to Zola's but - as many have pointed out - the league is stronger than last year outside of the top 5. There are no Hulls. There are no Portsmouths. In that respect, maybe it is simply that the current crop of players are just not good enough, maybe. But that's not gonna change anytime soon.
Grant does fail to inspire in my view. There appears to be a loss of confidence in hime by some key pleyers by all accounts. It is for those reasons, along with the lack of points that he is being almost universally lambasted in my view.
How can you be right about Zola when there was nothing to compare? In fact, I told you there was nothing to compare and your reaction was to create the Grantazola index. Unfortunately for you, Zola came out on top. How was you right HF? The index fell flat on it's face. Your own index told you that Zola was better! So your next plan was to tell me that the league s stronger this year. But that only proves my initial point that it was impossible to compare! Either way, you're stuck.
Everything I said about Grant was factual. You are saying I am not judging objectively because you cannot stand to see my view be proven right. That's why you'd rather stain my character and accuse me of anti-semitism. I have to say that was poor.
"And as for the players' criticism. He wasn't Jose so they were never going to like him were they?" Shoddy excuse. So why did his mate sack him?
Ok then, tell us this; when will you make up your mind about Grant? If it has only been 5 months, how long will be long enough in your view? Of course, we will probably be mid-table Championship by then, when we can make the change now and let someone have a go at keeping us up even if it is low probability. It is still worth a go. There is no point giving up getting out of trouble i.e. keeping Grant. How long HF?
Yes Headmaster, and if you take your point in regards to the league being stronger this year to be true, and you explore further, the question that is raised is why did Avram, when he had time and money, not adequately improve us?
No it did not. Zola took over a mid table team and turned them into a side that in 16 out of 17 years in the Prem would have been relegated! He was sacked and Grant inherited the mess. Grant has spent next to nothing and you know that!
Did Zola sell through his own choice? Come on HF, you're more intelligent than that.
Mess or no mess, Zola kept us up with it. Granted added and still he's about to take us down.
How long you gonna give Grant?
Going round in circles Stani. Zola added more players than Grant. Zola took us down 7 places in the table, Grant 3 so far. Remove the results against Pompey and Hull, and Zola's last 18 games yielded 12 points, Grant's 17 have yielded 12 points. Sadly Pompey and Hull are no longer in the division!
Yes, and we have Pompey's manager!
Why are you removing points? Hahaha Zola did not have the backing of the owners. That's beside the point, you said Zola left Grant a mess but Zola kept us up with it.
Why didn't Grant sort the 'mess' out HF? He had time, money and support of the Chairmen? Is it because he's a poor manager by any chance that hasn't got a clue about football?
And how long will you give him HF if now is too soon? Why are you not telling us?
HF you say grant hasn't spent much. well by my reckoning his spent 8 million with 4 million on reid who never plays and 4 million on barrera who to be honest looks shite. anyway how much have newcastle, west brom and blackpool spent this season and where are they in the league. and them 3 clubs have only just been promoted and their squad on paper ain't nowhere as good as west hams.
I would give him 2 seasons, like we gave Zola.
1949, the Reid and Barrera deals involve stage payments that will be triggered based on sell on value from what I understand. I doubt we have shelled out more than £4m in total. The debt has come down from £110m to £85m remember.
Stani, why haven't these "young" Islamic nations sorted out their messes yet? You reckon they need time! You do operate double standards don't you?
Anyway, out for a Christmas curry with my football team. so apologies I can't post your replies until later!
Has anyone seen the Brady interview today? They are going to stick with him chaps,fizzy pop here we come!
What have Islamic nations got to do with giving a football manager time at a club? More Islamophobia HF.
You know I didn't used to believe the guys on here that used to accuse you of racism/discrimination, and I even defended you on occasions. Now I'm not so sure.
Didn't watch Pilger's documentary then? Ignorance is bliss I suppose.
Stani, either you are stupid, which I don't believe, or you are so indictrianated by Islam that you shut your mind down utterly because you are terrified of having your faith challenged by reason.
Of course there is a parallel. You say Islamic states need TIME to sort out their problems. . So why, exactly, is the management of a state and an economy so different from the management of a football club?
The same applies to maco as to micro. The economy and the state is just an amalgum of individual business units and personal choices. If Grant could buy Rooney, Tevez, Terry, Fabregas, Vidic, Ashley Cole, Johnson, Cech, Lampard, Gerrard etc, we would not be struggling against relegation.
Sadly we cant afford to do so, in the same way as Pakistan cannot afford to buy it's way out of Third World status. The terrible thing about other "Islamic" states is that they are the Manchester Uniteds and Chelseas of their region but still choose to fail because Isam allows a highly privileged monority to exploit the mass of the population.
You will say, of course, that they need time to resolve these issues. Well, on that basis, either Allah needs to be sacked just like Grant or Grant deserves "time" to sort out West Ham!
Apologies for the spelling errors above. I had drunk too many beers!
Not watch the documentary then HF? But I'm the one who is afraid to be challenged?
I'm not afraid to have my faith challenged. But to have it negatively brought up in a conversation about a football manager says everything about you. In fact, it shows that you are the one who is afraid, afraid of my faith.
"So why, exactly, is the management of a state and an economy so different from the management of a football club?"
You're right, I'm not the stupid one.
"Isam allows a highly privileged monority to exploit the mass of the population."
Yep, that doesn't happen in your capitalist world HF! You guys invented this exploitation! If you were honest, you would concede that there is no interest in Islam, and 2.5% of every Muslim's disposal income is given to the needy every year. Implement that system globally and we'll see if there is any such difference between rich and poor. But you use non-Islamic societies and say they are Islamic? I told you before that there is no state in the world that truly follows slam rule of law so how can you say it is Islam's fault? It is man's fault.
And you have the nerve to make that point after what your banks did recently? Astonishing.
Pakistan isn't sorting out it's problems, it is sorting out the problem that your Prime minister and his mate George across the pond started.
Keep drinking the beers HF! Not your fault these spelling mistakes! Today it's spelling mistakes, tomorrow it's something more serious.
Instead of the insults Stani, address the issues. My point is, you claim it takes time for Islamic states to mature and resolve their problems but you expect Grant to sort out the mess left behind by Zola immediately. When Rose took over M&S, he wasn't expected to resolve the problems in 6 months. If no progress was being made after 2 years, the pressure would be on, but 6 months is an absurd window to be judging upon. You have to be consistent to have any credibility. You aren't. I try to be. Zola had the best part of two years; I would give Grant the same.
2.5% of every Muslim's disposable income? My arse and big deal! I pay tax at 40% and a great chunk of that goes to help people less fortunate than myself - and many of them are Muslims because we do not discriminate. In fact, one area the Tories have not cut is overseas aid. If the West introduced tax rates of 2.5%, we would see the same abject poverty and obscene wealth in Britain as we see across the Isllamic world.
As a socialist, I am no supporter of the excesses of the banks, but don't pretend that is a Western phenomenon. How obsecenely wealthy are the rich in Islamic states and how obscenely poor are the poor? And you BOAST about 2.5% being given to the poor! And that assumes it happens, which, of course, it doesn't!
Which nations gave the most aid to Indonesia after the Tsunami Stani? It wasn't the Islamic states was it?
And the Caliphs were socialists according to you, I suppose! Capitalism did not invent wealth and poverty!
"I told you there was nothing to compare and your reaction was to create the Grantazola index. Unfortunately for you, Zola came out on top. How was you right HF? The index fell flat on it's face. Your own index told you that Zola was better! So your next plan was to tell me that the league s stronger this year. But that only proves my initial point that it was impossible to compare! Either way, you're stuck"
Tee hee hee heee
1949 great point! again HF is kippered... he's stuck in the corner and can't get out but round and round he goes, but where he goes nobody knows.
It's funny how people jump on other people's words without actually reading them. The fact is Grant will be sacked if he loses the next few games, and will be nothing to do with his religion or nationality. FWIW, I agree with Hammersfan - give him the same as Zola, 2 years. Considering what he's got to work with - a club stripped of its assets over the last 10 years because of incompetent/greedy/clueless/opportunistic ownership and cut price managership, I would still speculate that Grant DOES still have the dressing room. The players are not the best of course [lol] - but Grant must get them playing together AS A TEAM. His reputation - such as it is - rests on it too. Where would he go if he flops here ? Not back to Israel I guess, unless he wants to live off what his wife earns and live in a state under constant threat beacuse of its expansionist policies.
Portsmouth wasn't really a true test eithet, and with Chelski, it was JM's team. Now we have Downes, and the defence is a bit better - looks like Tompkins must have been listening, and about time too. If the daves really want to keep PL status, they must spend large, at least 20 million. I don't understand why they wont go for that, seeing as the cash wont be paid in one hit, but staggered. Even today, they should be able to arrange the financing of three or four qaulity players, even if only until the end of the season. Money where mouth is etc. Or will they flop too and take the whole lot into oblivion?
As for Stani's comments about his religion, it's irrelevant to me -I'm a paid-up atheist. Like George Carlin, I pray to Joe Pesci - he does just as well as 'God' [see Youtube]...and getting into comparing religions is to me a form of mild psychosis, no offence meant.
'Gateman' - from forest gate,
WHU since 1957 [started when went to same school as Boyce & Sissons - I was with the O's before [lol]]
The defense is better? The defense is just as shit as it has ever been.
Yeah, the defense is better. Not very much, just a bit, but sow's ear etc. But that little bit better might make a difference over the rest of the season. Then again it might not, but that's football. If I was looking at it objectively, I would say this is what you get after a lack of real investment combining with clueless administration[s].
gateman
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