I do not wear claret and blue goggles and am happy to evaluate players based on their ability and performance, rather than according to club allegience. In my opinion, Hart and Robinson are better keepers than Green. In my opinion, Lampard, Gerrard, Barry, Milner and co are all better options for the England midfield than Parker. Others will dispute that and I am happy to engage in the debate. But I will engage without prejudice and I will put personal ego to one side. So what if I am proved wrong? I want to be! I want West Ham to win!
But look at this cobblers from my old adversary on the Org, davefking, who has a pathological hatred for Carlton Cole - a hatred that saw him post that he was PLEASED when Cole was injured last season. I quote:
"Cole deserved a nought. he didn't run, didn't challenge, didn't try, in fact to me, he looked like he was in one great big sulk at being dropped. You'd have thought he would have run his little cotton socks off after that kick up the backside, because if Cole has one attribute, it is his work rate. Yesterday he didn't even TRY."
Now, I am happy to concede that Piquionne and Obinna looked superb as a pairing, and I am happy to say that both have looked much better than Cole so far this season. But to accuse Cole of not running and of not trying is absurd.
Mr King may not have noticed that we were leading 1-0 in the second half and that the tactics shifted. Noble was pulled deeper and the emphasis shifted from attack to protecting what we had by the time Cole was introduced. Look at Noble's positioning when we took corners in the second half. He was holding, protecting against a Tottenham break. As a result, we became compact defensively but stretched offensively. Unlike in the first half, when we played an expansive 4-4-2 system, with Obinna and Piquionne up front and Dyer playing pretty high too, we reverted to 4-5-1, with Obinna pulling back into midfield and Noble dropping deeper. Cole was isolated, doing the job that two men, and sometimes three, were doing in the first 45.
To claim that Cole didn't run is ridiculous. I remember a shot on the turn from inside the box, over on the left. I also remember Cole holding the ball up waiting for support over on the right. The truth is, he operated right across the width of the pitch and when he received the ball, it was invariably with two Tottenham defenders up his arse because there was nobody else left for them to mark. Cole did his job, and did it pretty well. He was an out ball. He worked the full width of the pitch and ensured that Huddlestone had to sit deeper, filling the gap that appeared between Tottenham's centre halves and the half way line. Why did this gap appear? Because Corluka and Bassong, no slouches, were frightened of Cole's pace. Mr King may also have missed the fact that for the last 5 minutes, Obinna was off the pitch, leaving Cole utterly isolated up front. But where was the game played for the most of that five minutes? In Tottenham's half!
This sort of bitterness is very sad. Why put personal ego, bitterness and prejudice ahead of your love for the club? Yes Mr King, claim that Cole is inferior to Piquionne and Obinna, you can make that case. Yes, say he is unworthy of a place in the England squad, you can make that case too. But suggest that he didn't try yesterday? To claim he didn't run, that he was in a sulk, that he merited ZERO as a rating? That is small minded bitterness speaking, that is an ego desperate to be proved right. It is that sort of attitude that saw fans turn on Frank Lampard Junior and help drive him from the club. I suspect that Mr King would have taken a 1-1 draw rather than see Cole score a late winner!
Supporting West Ham does not mean that we have to pretend every player in the team is the dog's dangly bits, but supporting West Ham should not embrace wishing ill upon players just so we are proved right! I would love Green and Parker to prove me wrong - and yesterday was a good start! Dear God, I am even accepting that Boa can do a job for us! Let's judge things honestly eh? Let's put ego to one side!
16 comments:
I agree, I recently sometimes find myself wishing Cole wasn't in the team, but on reflection it isn't that he isn't any good or doesn't try. It is entirely because of the tactics used most of the time that he has played.
He is always isolated up front on his own and even when we are playing with 3 up front, it's with two wide forwards who quickly revert to a 4-5-1 when off the ball at a compromise to supporting Cole.
I don't think Cole is good enough for England and do find myself sighing when he is playing, but we need him, his hard work and his strength. Who knows if we start playing him with supporting strikers he might start banging in the goals.
Lampard deserved and still deserves it and It's not the fans that drove him out it was his inflated ego. if you don't believe me read his self pitying excuse for a book
I take your point in general HF. But as I commented yesterday, I was relieved to see that Grant left Carlton on the bench. It was the best decision after (finally!) picking Da Costa. Why? Because Cole is very good in the physical game and in holding up the ball (although I must admit in the last few games he did not even do that well) but he is not a goal scorer, he is not sharp enough and far too predictable. Don't get me wrong. I think he has something to offer the team and he did help when he came in yesterday. As you say, defenders have a hard time marking him and all that. But that is not enough to justify his selection. He has to fight for his place and perform in order to win his place in the team.
Read a book "written" by a footballer? Why would I do that? I am a bit beyond, "Here is Frank. Frank has the ball. Frank kicks the ball. The ball is in the net. Frank is happy."
"Here is Frank. Frank has the girl. Frank screws the girl. Frank is happy."
"Here is the girl. The girl kicks Frank in the balls. Frank is not happy."
"Here is Frank. Frank is with the girl. Adrian Chiles is not happy."
He's had a poor start to the season mate, but he will come good. I remain a fan of Carlton's.
But face facts, Green was always a disaster waiting to happen. Thank God it happened today and not in the final. Now Capello knows what I have known all along, that Green is a nearly man, a Graeme Hick or Mark Ramprakash figure. He's good, bloody good until the pressure builds...and then he cracks.
I suspect Green's international career ended tonight. Indeed, I suspect that had we had three substitutions open to us at half time, Green would have been spared the second 45 minutes. Look at "that save" closely. The ball hit Green's trailing hand, the wrong hand, which is why he needed the post to save him. We lost two World Cup points tonight because of Green and could have lost three. Does ANYBODY believe Hart, James or Robinson would have conceded that goal? You are in Claret and Blue denial if you do!
And for the record, this is what I said on here earlier today: "Big question - where's the evidence of this terrible ball? It seems to be behaving fairly normally to me. Having said that, it will now take a terrible swerve tonight and Green will end up looking a clown!" That looks like another one I've got right then.
And your point? I didn't want Green to fail. As a West Ham and England fan I was desperate for him NOT to fail. But I knew he was a bad choice because I knew he lacked the mental strength for the job. And I was right.
Do I say I was happy that he failed? Grumpy, and this may be you Grumpy, said he was PLEASED when Cole was injured, leaving us with just Hines to lead the line at the time! Grumpy rated Cole ZERO yesterday after a pretty reasonable performance after he came on. Green, on the other hand, had a mare against the USA, just as I feared he would.
Sorry I was right. You don't blame the weather man when he says it will piss down with rain and is then proved right, do you? I didn't make Green spill a shot that 999 out of a thousand pub keepers would save. If you are Grumpy, you will know that I have been 100% consistent about Green - great shot stopper when he doesn't have time to think, very average all round keeper because of poor technique under crosses and suspect temperament. But I would LOVE to be proved wrong. Sadly, Rob proved me right at the World Cup. Don't shoot the weather man!
By the way, well done for hunting that down. How much does it matter to you? Amazing! You really do take what I write to heart don't you? This is a kind of hero worship you realise!
Dave it is you! Logged in to the Org at the same time! How are you keeping? How's the new job? Obviously had a great time on Saturday!
PS Who am I on the Org? Go on, have a guess!
Oops, you've facked off!
i really didnt rate cole when he came on against tottenham, i thought he did ok, is it just me then, coz 90% of the time when i see him play he really struggles to get the ball under control, he struggles to get it down to his feet, but when i see piquionne he 90% of the time does it effortlessly, he also runs after balls that cole wouldnt even give a second thought about, i saw the change in tactics which obviously made it harder for cole, but was not impressed, he refused to chase the ball and pressure defenders unless there were 20,000 fans shouting at him, i was near the front of the west stand lower towards the bobby moore end and me and many people around me were constantly shouting at him to pressure and when he did he got a corner, but didnt do it nearly enough for a guy who had just lost his place and i really doubthe will ever get it back.
A TRUE West Ham fan would never want to see one of their players injured! He must support somebody else surely? No right minded person would actually write that.
He cant really be a West Ham. No decent,rightminded person would actually write that they wanted 1 of their own players injured!!
It's all about opinions and most of us think we're right. To use your examples, but stating my opinion, Hart is currently better than Green, but Green is better than Robinson. Like you I would put Parker behind Lampard and Gerrard but I regard him as on a par with Milner and ahead of Barry (who I don't rate). I'd have had him in the WC 23, but probably wouldn't have played him even then.
Opinions will differ on Cole too. Before his injury last season he was playing well and scoring goals. When he returned (possibly brought back a bit too early due to our desparate situation) he didn't look fully fit and so his performances were not as good. This affected his confidence and it became a viscious circle. At times it looked as if he wasn't trying. I'm not saying he wasn't but it looked that way.
This season, despite a good pre-season he began showing poor confidence and form and not looking the player of a year ago. I thought that being dropped might bring out a 'bust-a-gut' performance when he came on. It didn't seem to, but it was better than he had been. Also, as you say, the gap between the midfield and the forwards grew as the match went on making his job much harder.
I remain open minded about him, but without a doubt he isn't currently playing to his potential. I hope he soon does though as it can only be good for the team.
Spot on mate. And it is different opinions that make sport the joy that it is!
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